Anne: I'm very excited about my new friend that is on my podcast today, and she grew up in Johannesburg. She left in 1995 to attend B-School, and embark on a career on Wall Street. Investing in public and private companies. She finally saw the light in 2017 and became a dental entrepreneur, or as we like to say, she became a do a dental entrepreneur woman.
After a few years at Henry Schein's Innovation Center. She honed her entrepreneurial chops at Jarvis Analytics, and now at Plan Forward. Now Africa is calling and she's planning to scale Kilimanjaro in the spring. Please help me welcome the the brave and fierce. Jane Levy. Hey, Jane. Hey,
Jane: Anne. Lovely to be
Anne: here.
So nice to have you. I we're so excited because you debuted yourself and our Dental Entrepreneur, the Future of Dentistry. And um, it just reached my mailbox and I'm glad it got to your mailbox as well. I was, I was really loving this edition. It's so yummy. And, um, for all of you that are listening. Today you can go on our website Dentalentrepreneur.com and find Jane's article along with all the other articles in, in this edition.
And, um, you know, we just ask people to share what's going on in their businesses and, and how we can support our industry and the industry that we, we really love. And, you know, with Jane, I mean Jane. So you came over, I mean, B-School. What made you wanna go to B-School.
Jane: Uh, great question. So, growing up in South Africa, uh, we, we knew that things were, um, changing very rapidly and, uh.
You know, I had family members that had left the country. I knew that, um, that was probably the path for me that I didn't wanna stay, um, in South Africa. And, um, and I thought that I would have many more opportunities if I left the country. And, um, so I thought the best way to do that and to integrate myself in a new country was to attend, uh.
School or attend college, um, or, you know, in my case, business school, um, in the, in, you know, my new country. And so that's, that was my path, um, into the U.S. And it was a good one because I certainly made a lot of contacts. I, um, I, you know, found a job obviously after business school in New York City. And so it really helped me kind of launch my new, my new Life in the U.S.
Anne: Wow. Where did you go to B-School.
Jane: I went to B-School at MIT Sloan. Um, and, uh, what,
Anne: what? Yeah. Hello. Oh my gosh, you're such smarty pants. That's amazing.
Jane: It was amazing. Uh, you know, I, I had always loved technology. Have started my career as a programmer and, um, just saw the transformational effect of technology and knew that I was also very entrepreneurial.
So it was the ideal place for me because it offered, you know, kind of an entrée to both. And actually, when I started my career on Wall Street, I covered technology companies, uh, which was fabulous and a fun time to do it because it was during the.com boom and then bust.
Anne: Yes. Wow. That's when it all just started happening.
I mean, that's, I mean, I was think of 1995. That's not that long. That's not that long ago. I mean, you know, it just feels like to me things were just getting started, but that the bus then was right then as well. But just to see people just go all the way up the mountain that's talk about Kilimanjaro. I mean, they go up the mountain and they just kind of fell off the cliff that at at some point.
But to be involved in that, you learn so much, right? I mean, gosh, the good, the bad, and the ugly. A hundred percent.
Jane: And actually, uh, I remember so many companies coming public and some were even pre-revenue. They didn't even have any revenue. It was just a concept at the time. Uh, and it was a very formative time of my career, uh, when I had to, you know, spend time sorting through and researching these extremely young companies that, um, and, and really try and find the ones that were investible even though there was no revenue and barely, barely a product.
And that's really what got me. Kind of like hooked on the whole entrepreneurship journey. Uh, and, uh, you know, and that's, and that's what I've done, you know, since ninety-five really is just focus on, uh, how to essentially grow, grow companies and, and find companies that, um, that, that have a path, um, to, to profitability or to an exit.
Anne: Yeah. That is so cool. So yeah, we should talk because, you know, I think if you're an entrepreneur and you're building a company, you, you really have to have the mindset that you want to scale it and sell it sometime, because as entrepreneurs, I could speak for myself, most of the money that we make, we pull back into the company.
And so at the end of, it's not like working for somebody and you've got this nice 401k because. Frankly, like my husband had a lovely 401k and um, and then when he was about 42, decided to start his own company. So, great, we'll be millionaires, but then, you know, guess what? It's not that easy. And so then you start sifting out your, your money and your riches, and you put 'em into your, into your business because.
If you're, if you're like my husband, you have belief in what you're doing and you just can't quit. And so I think that is really interesting to be able to actually own the fact that you can come in and help someone scale to the point where somebody else thinks, sees the value. We'll buy it because of that kinda makes everybody whole again and, and, um, and makes your dream a reality so that you're, and, and your family members say, well, now I get it.
Okay, now I get it. Good job. Right? Because so often you don't have a lot of support, you know, around you when you're, when you're, you know, as an entrepreneur. Do you see it as a roller coaster Jane, because I, I've seen it as a roller coaster. How do you see entrepreneurship?
Jane: That's a great point. I mean, entrepreneurship is a grind.
It really is. And it requires grit beyond measure. Uh, I will say that, um, totally agree with what you, what you laid out. Um, you know, as I think about, uh, you know, the, the journey of being an entrepreneur and bringing an idea to life and then. Growing that idea. Um, you know, you think of any space even, you know, let's say artificial intelligence in dentistry.
Um, you know, a couple of years ago, uh, 5, 6, 7 years ago, it was a brand new idea. Uh, and now look how competitive that space is. So it's extremely hard to maintain a moat, um, as a company and, uh. To transition a company through the different phases of growth. Um, and, you know, and diff you know, different parts of its life cycle.
And it's all our dream to grow a big company and to grow multi-billion dollar company that goes public ultimately. But, uh, the real, the reality is that it's extremely hard to do. And so, um, sometimes, uh, the, the best way to unlock value. Both for, you know, if you've taken outside investors money or even for yourself as the entrepreneur is to merge with another company and to exit, uh, you know, sometimes earlier than you wish.
But, uh, but certainly, uh, you know, that journey is a hard one. Uh, I do wanna say that that is actually how I got into dental. Uh, I had no intention of, of, uh, you know, moving out of technology. But, um, I read an article, uh, back in probably 20 15, 20 16, um, and it was about, um, venture capital, um, going into dentistry.
And at the time, um, I think in 2015, in fact, I have the, the report in front of me. I pulled it up, um, in 2015. $15 million had been invested in dental products and services, and that increased in 2016 to 95 million. In particular, there were two companies that were funded in 2016. There was Sanendo and Convergent, Dental and um, and that really piqued my interest.
Um, and I, you know, started to look deeper into dental because that that growth rate was exceptional, um, far faster than, than any other space in healthcare. And, uh. So that's when I, I became interested in, in dental. And um, the funny story is that, uh, I lived in the same building as Stan Bergman. And, uh, we were working together on a fund to raise money for our undergraduate university in South Africa called the University of the Witwatersrand.
And uh, and in the course of some of those conversations, I said to him, you know. I noticed this trend, this huge investment bubble going into dental and, uh, and asked whether Henry Schein had a, a venture fund or something, you know, along those lines where they were getting exposure to this, to this, you know, this clearly huge growth in dental.
And uh, and that's when, you know, he said, well, why don't you come and, and work in our innovation group and. You know, and, and let's study the market together. And that's how I got into dental. Oh my gosh.
Anne: That's such a great story. Wow. And then was Jarvis Analytics already something and then you just came in and worked with When the, in that, uh, you know that lane
Jane: I.
Yeah, exactly. So, so actually in 2019, so I joined Henry Shine in 2017. A couple of years later in 2019, we did a deep dive into, uh, membership plans, and that's when I make making a plan forward for the first time. But that aside, uh, back to Jarvis, Jarvis was one of the companies that I came across and thought, you know, was doing some exceptional work.
Uh, and so, um, when Covid hit and Shine. Kind of stopped doing deals and uh, and obviously everybody was sent home for an indefinite period. Um, I left Shine and joined Jarvis, uh, as Chief Growth Officer, uh, to help them scale the business and, and um, and that was a fun time too. That was also a roller coaster because within a year we had sold that company to Shine.
Anne: Wow. Yeah. Oh man, that is fun. Hmm. And so you're an expert in that. And so no wonder that, um, Megan just saw something in you and had, you know, been friends, I guess, or knew each other, and did she reach out to you and say, Hey, I need help. Come, come work with us. Uh,
Jane: good question Anne. So actually, um, so, so when I, when we had sold Jarvis, I, uh, I.
Started to ramp up my work with Jeremy Crell at, uh, Revere. Uh, and, um, as you know, Revere is very focused on, um, the oral space and, um, investing in early stage oral companies. And, uh, as part of my work with Revere, I reached back out to Megan thinking, you know, maybe membership plans are a good place to invest.
And, uh, we reconnected and, uh. Discovered that we have a lot of, um, overlap in terms of the va, our values and the way we, we think about the world. But, um, certainly in terms of our skill set we're very complimentary. And, uh, and so that's when we started figuring out that actually we, we love talking to each other and make, I.
And popped on a plane and came to Manhattan, uh, for lunch. And, um, and when we met in person, we realized, um, this was definitely something we could, we could contemplate, uh, working together and, you know, really scaling the business.
Anne: Wow. That's, that is just really cool. And so female owned. And it's, and it's growing.
Yeah. And the energy. Oh. 'cause I was at ADOM and your booth had so much energy and of course you've got Janelle Stork and she's just such a, an integrator and a strategist and, you know, executor, right? Oh my gosh. Um, you know, I wouldn't, I wouldn't bet, bet a bet against the three of you for anything in the whole world.
You guys are gonna just do it. And it's so neat because I think membership plans. They are, they are just emerging. And it's only been a couple of years, I think since, since actually it, it's gotten to the level, like you actually got some competition in a sense. But competition's great because we, it helps everybody understand that, that this is something we need.
Right. I, I, I keep thinking, why don't we have, I can't wait for some big company to put something on. 60 minutes and, um, as a commercial for membership plans for dentistry because everybody, the more I read about it and your article is so great, and dental entrepreneur, again, everybody check it out. It's on our website, why you need a membership plan and why it's great for the business and why it's great for retention and it's great for your patients and everybody wins and everybody gets care.
And I, I just, it's, it's like a no brainer, Jane and they just emerged. I don't know, when was the first. Membership plan even started. Yeah,
Jane: so Mape will tell you that they've been around a long time, actually, probably. Yeah, probably, you know, 10 years or so. Um, and a lot of practices that we come across actually have membership plans, but they're running them internally.
Uh, and I think this is the key, the key point. The key point is that, um, if you think of a. Um, kind of a, a bell-shaped curve and where we are in terms of adoption of membership plans, we are really at the beginning stages of the mainstream market. And that's, that's the stage at which, um, you know, practices are looking, uh.
For productivity improvement. So these are, um, you know, generally speaking these are not necessarily early adopters 'cause we are, we are kind of in the later stage of, of, of early adoption. But these are the pragmatists, the folks that, that want understand the value of the membership plan. And um, and so we are definitely reorienting the business to focus on, you know, how members member the membership software can be used as a strategic tool and how, um.
Practices can, uh, understand better the value of their cash patients and vis-a-vis certainly those that, uh, those of those, um, insured patients, um, and the way that insured patients behave versus how they cash patients behave. Uh, and. You know, we feel that we have the, the wind in our backs in terms of the trend away from insurance and the fact that, uh, you know, payers, unfortunately, many of them have not renegotiated reimbursement for 15 years or so.
And so, um, for practices that are still, uh, getting reimbursed at rates, you know. Uh, from, from way back when, um, uh, being a network is no longer an option and, uh, you know, but certainly they wanna make decisions to move out of network in a very informed way, and that's where a platform like ours can help them because they can.
They can get access to data around the behavior of their, their cash patients, their membership patients, their discount patients, and ultimately also their patients, um, who are insured and do an A side-by-side assessment to see what's best for their practice.
Anne: Hmm. Okay. That's, well, that's key because they need that kind of data to, to be able to more invest in it and take the time and effort that it means to, to enroll all their patients.
Right. They need a, they need a reason for it. They need to have some belief in it. And as dentists are such, uh, analytics. They need that, that just to, uh, you know, share with their team because it's gotta be a team effort when you have people coming in and introducing this to, uh, their patients. And I just love your, you know, we, I you've got a little fur baby, I hear over there.
He's, he, he, he wants to be on the, um, on the webinar, on the podcast. On the podcast as well. I just love it. Welcome. Everyone's welcome. Everyone's welcome here. Right. I love that. You'll be happy to
Jane: know. It's Stella. She's a deuce
Anne: Stella. She's a do. mm-Hmm. Oh, she is. She's a woman. And she happens to be in dentistry.
She's a do. That's right. That's perfect. Isn't that so great? Oh my gosh. Well, the thing about also with the, the, um, the membership plans is that, you know, you were mentioning in.
The retention and they come back and they take more treatment. Like you're, when you were giving the statistics, which is really cool. And I just did a podcast with Tom Snyder who I, you know, do you know Tom from Henry? Schein? He, do you know Im I dot Mm-Hmm. Well he was, he's in transitions with Henry Schein.
He just did, he did an article in this edition as well, and he is a big statistic guy. He's like, given all these statistics and you gave a lot of statistics in your article as well, and by the time I was finished with reading it, I was like, oh my gosh, this shout from the rooftops. That if you don't have a membership plan, you're crazy because it really makes so much sense.
And like you said, the wind is in your, the back, in your back because I don't know one office that is happy that they have to deal with insurance. Right. It's, it's just a time suck for the, for everybody and they have to hire it out now. And this is just makes perfect sense. I mean, and I can even relate to my daughter who.
She always had, you know, uh, mama as a dental hygienist working, so she doesn't even know what it's like to pay for her own dental care. 'cause it was always free. Right? And so when she, you know, got her first, uh, gig and, and she bought her, she has her own business and so she bought dental insurance and it didn't cover anything and she was shocked at it.
And, you know, we knew that. And I tried to say, Kate, I don't really think you need this. This is not something you need, but nobody, the real. World doesn't still understand how valuable this opportunity is to be, um, in the membership plan. Have the regular appointments know that the dentist has your bag, get the discount, and you don't have to worry about all this other stuff and you're not using.
It's just, it's just unbelievable how the, the, uh, insurance companies, meaning, you know, they have really fooled America into thinking that it's a good thing and that everybody needs it, and in, in, in reality, this is just an answer to that pain point.
Jane: Absolutely couldn't agree with you more. Uh, and the, and the shocking stats are that if there are a hundred million uninsured Americans, um, adults, at least, um, 40 million still see the dentist.
And so those 40 million are coming in and paying cash, um, for their, for their treatment, for their preventative care. And, um, it's just not affordable. Um, and certainly not affordable to come in twice a year, which, as you know, is the standard of care according to the ADA. So there is also 60 million who are not even coming into the dentist.
And, um, and plan forward certainly see, wants to address both those segments of the market. Um, 40, those 40 million that are coming into the dentist obviously can be, um, reached through the dental practice, but those, um, 60 million who are not even coming into the practice, uh, can be, you know, can, we can get to them through the employers and, uh, it's, it's the one of the biggest, um.
You know, small, medium businesses with less than 50 employees. Uh, very few of them actually offer dental as a benefit, and yet it's, it's, um, one of the most sought after benefits. So, um, membership plans can be a great way for, um, those employees, especially gig workers, part-time workers, um, and those who are cost sensitive to access oral care.
Anne: Oh yeah. You just said something that struck me. Now, if you have a small business Yeah. Would it behoove you as a small business to say to all, everyone that's working for you, we're going to enroll you in this membership plan. Do you, does that happen then? I, I was thinking, I'm thinking one-on-one. I didn't catch that.
So that, that's a great perk, um, for your employees, which. Really is affordable and it's just a thank you. And it's like, again, it hope it helps. That's a, Yeah, I could, I could sell that, um, just to small businesses because it's something that you can give to your employees and that it holds them. Like, boy, I, I work for a great company.
I can't leave 'cause I actually have this dental plan. And it's really not. Um, it's a one, it's a, it's a, um, it's a monthly fee, but, you know, everyone is used to that now. I mean, again, the wind at your back, I mean, this has been going, you've had it for a long time, but now it just seems normal that everybody has a, uh, you have a dental membership plan now.
Yes,
Jane: absolutely. No, it is, it is. It's, um, it's, uh, well it's, it's, it's kind of a slam dunk because the employer can subsidise, just like they do with insurance. They can pay part of the, uh, membership fee or they could pay the entire fee, uh, or they could even allow the employee to choose, uh, their provider and therefore the membership plan.
And they could reimburse them after the fact. So there's many different ways that the employer can help the employee to pay for this benefit. Uh, it doesn't, you know, the, the old way of paying for, uh, someone's insurance, you know, uh, is, is kind of, uh, of the past. There are many employers that are self-insuring these days, and so membership plans are becoming more and more attractive for those types of employers.
Anne: Well, there's another thing there too, though. It, you know, it's great when you have your employer, you know, give you that benefit, but I also feel like people need skin in the game. And that's the other thing I like about the membership plan is like, if you're paying so much a year, you are gonna go to the dentist.
And that was something else you mentioned in your article. Like, because if you don't have insurance, you, you usually, you, you know, at this point. Especially after Covid and people are in inflation and everything, that's just way down on the bat, on the bottom of the list of things they have to do unless they have a toothache.
Mm-Hmm. But if you know you're paying for something and you get your two re-care appointments a year, by golly you're gonna, you're gonna go in and get those re-care appointments. It's even different than having insurance from your employee in a sense. It's like you're paying for it and you take ownership in it.
And I think in, in every mode of healthcare, we as, as the patient, need to take ownership in our own health. And it makes it, it just, uh, works for everybody better. 'cause we take better care of ourselves that way because we own it. And somebody else
X90PCW50SZqONnbxk4Sq_The_Future_of_Dentistry_Ep_14_-_Jane_Levy_v2-cm: doesn't.
Jane: Absolutely agree. And so, um, you know, so it, it seems like just such a slam dunk, doesn't it?
Mm-Hmm. That this is an ideal way for both the patient to access their oral care and take care of their, you know, take responsibility for taking care of their mouths and their, and their health overall, uh, as well as for the provider. It's, it's just such a great way to. Keep those patients coming in, keep them loyal.
Uh, one of our practices even said that you, you know, the membership plan has allowed him to transition away from transaction-based patients to relationship.
Anne: Patients. Oh, that's a beautiful way
Jane: to say it. Yeah. And, uh, you know, he's loved that. So he's not filling his chair time with, uh, patients that say no to every kind of treatment and who are not really invested in the health of their mouths.
Uh, to those that are really trusting, you know, and, and take, take ownership of the oral journey. Yeah.
Anne: And you know, I think people, and as again, following Covid people like a community. Yeah. And so if you're in the membership of your dentist and, and there's a lot of, um, um, really great relationship building tools within the plan, what, what sets you apart or where do you see the future, uh, with Plan Forward, Jane, anything new on the horizon that you think you're
Jane: working on?
Absolutely the product is always, um, morphing and changing. 'cause we work really hard to keep it fresh and to make sure that we are continuing to add value for our, uh, providers. We do have a lot of new launches coming up, um, including PMS integration, uh, so that we'll be able to, um, integrate to almost any PMS and pull the data on, on cash patients, uh, into our system so that uh, we can do all kinds of reporting.
Uh, as you know, we've also noticed that a lot of our practices are using Excel spreadsheets, uh, to, to kind of match production and collections. Uh, so we hope to do some of that on the platform too. That's, that's definitely in the works. And, uh, so a lot around their accounting and reporting around membership plans.
Uh, and, and really. Positioning the platform, uh, to really be a strategic tool for, um, a decision that's very, very important to most practices, which is to whether to stay in, in network or, or get out of network. So, uh, so I think that's how we are thinking about the future of the
Anne: platform. Well, that's gonna be good for everybody.
'cause then people are gonna get the care they need in the time they need it and feel good about paying for it. You know, because what you don't like to hear is, my insurance doesn't cover it. I'm not gonna take it. I'm, uh, you know, just extracted or whatever. I mean, I just know there's so many things that, you know, just drive, drive the, the profession to, uh, a burnout state and just to have that, um, solid.
Yes. And thank you. From your patient and your clientele, because you've got a relationship you've built, um, that's stronger with than without it. So, you know, I, I guess you must be, um, walking a lot and, um, you know, taking your steps every day because you're gonna be, you know, climbing Mount kiln, manjaro. I mean, come on.
What, where does that come from? Is that, has that been a dream of yours for your whole life? Uh, it has
Jane: been, it has been, um, you know, I have visited Tanzania a bunch of times, and every time I go I, uh, I think to myself, oh, wouldn't that be fantastic? Um, you know, I, it's, it's. It's quite a feat. Uh, from what I understand, the altitude is really the, the biggest, the biggest issue as well as, um, when people ascend to the summit on that last day.
I think you have to literally start climbing at midnight and climb, you know, through the night, uh, in order to ascend and make it down in time. So, um, so it is a little daunting. Uh, but I've got many friends who have climbed and, uh, and. I feel like I have to, uh, I have to at least summit the, the ceiling of Africa as they call it.
Uh, you know, it's, it's kind of, uh. The legacy that I, that I wish to leave
Anne: behind. Oh my gosh, that's so beautiful and exciting. And, and I followed a few friends. Keith Dreyer is one of 'em. I believe he went up there, right? And so I remember following his journey and, um, gosh, I just wish you all the best. Do you have your, you have all your plans.
Are you gonna go by yourself? Or you have a team, or you have people you're going with?
Jane: Uh, yeah. So we've got a group that are, that are going, actually some business school classmates from, from, uh, Sloan. Uh, so, uh, every now and again they organize a trip up and, uh, so miss the last one. But you're right, Keith Keith is definitely one of the inspirations, um, that I have.
Although he's a great runner, and so he's, you know, perpetually fit. And, you know, probably for him it was, it was a slam dunk. Uh, I'm not there. And, uh, and I'm definitely gonna have to, you know. Plan forward, I guess.
Anne: That's amazing how that plan forward just works. I love the name and it does, you just plan forward one step in front of the other and, and you, and you know what?
You just don't quit. That's right. That's due number, due number, uh, principle number nine. Start and don't stop. And, uh, that is wonderful. I will follow that journey and we will follow plan forward, forward, uh, again. I love your team. You and Megan are just amazing with Janelle. That's, I mean, I know you've got a lot of other people that are working with you, and we're gonna see you at the retreat in November.
If you, if you, if anybody's listening to this and they want a ticket, um, please, we still have some seats available in Charlotte, North Carolina, 10 11, half day on the 12th. We're all coming together as women in dentistry to lift each other up, inspire and empower and collaborate. So, Jane, thank you. It's just been a, it's been lovely getting to know you.
I can't wait to see where you take plan forward, um, in the future. And it's gonna be somewhere great. I know. So thank you so much today
Jane: and thanks for all your support. Have loved getting to know you again. Also so thrilled to have my article in the Dental Entrepreneur magazine and, um, hope to see you at the due conference for sure.
You know, most of our team will be there, but I hope to make it too.
Anne: That would be fantastic. That'd be fantastic. So again, check it out, dentalentrepreneur.com, the summer edition, and for all of you out there, most importantly, keep doing you.
